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Thread: So It's True That The Cell Phone Industry Sucks After All

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by kevink1 View Post
    I suspect that the phone's contacts app is probably checking the SIM to see if there is any data there, and not handling something.
    Yes, the SIM is the problem. When you take the SIM out Contacts works as you'd expect.

    Or, put another way, the problem was that RedPocket didn't know that their SIM won't work with this phone.

    Anyway, once I get the refund from RedPocket, I'm on to the next bozo phone company.

  2. #32
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    H20 SIM kits may still be available at various stores with an older 4g VoLTE capable SIM that can be activated.

    I've also heard that the AT&T SIM that comes with an AT&T branded prepaid phone might be able to be activated on a AT&T MVNO. Does anyone know if that's absolutely true?

    Black Wireless has plans much like H20 but the MVNO is owned by Red Pocket now. At least that's what I just saw online.

    Google search MVNOs that run on AT&T. I got a long list of them on the Best MVNOs site.

    Some may offer cheaper PayGo plans and offer 4g SIMs still, although if AT&T is selling only
    5g SIMs now, the MVNOs may be forced to. It makes little sense since 5g isn't in all areas yet and it requires a 5g device.

    Stores are my best guess for finding 4g SIMs. Or eBay, Amazon, but have to be careful with reading the listings, reviews, to be sure of what you're getting on private listings.

    It doesn't sound like the company offering the service has been selling you what you need either.


    Sent from my LGL423DL using HoFo mobile app

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Serial Port View Post
    What most people don't realize is that the SIM card measures memory by the Kilobyte and not a Megabyte or Gigabyte. The SIM doesn't have enough memory to store phone numbers anymore. Phone numbers are either stored in the phone memory or an SD card.
    Quote Originally Posted by kevink1 View Post
    my guess is that the 5g sims did something with the contacts portion of the SIM. The portion that most phones for years don't use to store contacts (very limited options), but can import from. I suspect that the phone's contacts app is probably checking the SIM to see if there is any data there, and not handling something.
    This could an idea.

    Did these new "5G SIMs" have the storage removed?

    If these SIMs have the storage removed, could the phone not seeing this storage, and just freezing at loading the contact list?

    Then again, could the SIM using this part of the SIM for some of the 5G stuff.

    I do not know how SIMs are built internally tho.

  4. #34
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    Just thinking out loud here. I wonder if Clueless Guy's problems with the 5G SIM aren't somehow related to KaiOS not being 5G compatible. If you look at the KaiOS website you won't see anything about 5G. Could it be that the Alcatel My Flip or Go Flip running KaiOS aren't really made for 5G or a 5G SIM card? They allow calls by using 4G but somehow disable the contacts. Just guessing.
    If you think the pandemic is bad now, just wait. Doctors tell us the next variant plays the accordion.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by advcomp2019 View Post
    This could an idea.

    Did these new "5G SIMs" have the storage removed?

    If these SIMs have the storage removed, could the phone not seeing this storage, and just freezing at loading the contact list?

    Then again, could the SIM using this part of the SIM for some of the 5G stuff.

    I do not know how SIMs are built internally tho.
    SIM cards no longer store phone contacts. It is a method for the cellular carriers to identify the phone and store roaming lists/profiles as well as a security method to protect users from having their phones cloned/stolen phone#'s which used to be a big problem. When SIM cards were first introduced, they stored the 10 digit phone # and a limited # of letters to identify the contact name. The phone or an SD card now stores that information.
    Just another day in paradise.....

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Relztrah View Post
    Just thinking out loud here. I wonder if Clueless Guy's problems with the 5G SIM aren't somehow related to KaiOS not being 5G compatible. If you look at the KaiOS website you won't see anything about 5G. Could it be that the Alcatel My Flip or Go Flip running KaiOS aren't really made for 5G or a 5G SIM card? They allow calls by using 4G but somehow disable the contacts. Just guessing.
    That was another idea that popped into my head, but when I doing research last night on this, I could not find any other KaiOS phones with this issue.

    It could be a KaiOS 2.5 issue only too.

    Like I said, I have not found any other phone with this issue when I did research last night.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Serial Port View Post
    SIM cards no longer store phone contacts. It is a method for the cellular carriers to identify the phone and store roaming lists/profiles as well as a security method to protect users from having their phones cloned/stolen phone#'s which used to be a big problem. When SIM cards were first introduced, they stored the 10 digit phone # and a limited # of letters to identify the contact name. The phone or an SD card now stores that information.
    I don't see where SIM cards, even 5G capable ones, CAN'T store contacts. It is just that the industry long went past the limited capabilities of SIM contacts. Even before I went with my first smart phone 15 years ago, my flip phone defaulted to storing the contacts on the phone. Which allowed multiple numbers, for instance, to be tied to an user.

    My speculation is that there is probably a difference in how sim storage is implemented. Probably documented somewhere, but the phone doesn't handle it right. Would likely be read only usage.
    iPhone 12 Pro is my current phone I carry.

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    The final chapter of this story is the question of whether RedPocket will provide the full refund I've requested. RedPocket has failed to provide the product they promised me, and have offered no other solution, so a refund seems the only way to proceed from here.

    I've requested the refund both on eBay, in the RedPocket ticket system, and in email replies to RedPocket agents. That was only yesterday and today, and it's the weekend now, so it's too soon to know the answer at this point.

    If the refund comes without further delay or hassle, I may consider using RedPocket again, maybe. If they fight me on the refund, then this thread will become more interesting. :-) We shall see.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by kevink1 View Post
    I don't see where SIM cards, even 5G capable ones, CAN'T store contacts.
    SIM cards and SD cards are not the same thing and each one has a separate function. SIM cards don't have sufficient memory/storage to retain phone contacts and that's it. No need to debate it or justify anything. I think my first cell phone had only 64 or 128 kilobytes of internal storage and my SIM had 8 kilobytes of storage. Technology has changed dramatically over the past several years.

  10. #40
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    2 years of service on flip phone for $30+tax

    Quote Originally Posted by Clueless Guy View Post
    Thanks for this. I'm now ready to learn more about this offer. The following might help....
    I'm doing pre-pay only. I'm not willing to give ANY cellphone company my credit card for recurring charges. If that's available on Tracphone, happy to hear about it.
    You won't have to give your credit card to Tracfone. And you won't incur recurring charges. Here's the how-to:

    1. Use an email that you haven't used on HSN. Use coupon code HSN2022. Get the flip+1yr for $30+tax at https://www.hsn.com/products/tcl-alc...ntext/20107742

    2. Activate the phone. Within 14 days of activation, sign up for Tracfone's rewards program with my referral code to get 8,000 rewards points. (Not supposed to post referral codes out here so please PM me for my code).

    3. The points are worth $80 and become available for use on the 61st day. Use the points to refill service with four $19.99 cards. Each card gives you 90 service days plus 60 min,text,data. Great thing about TF is that refills get added on top of your existing balance. So 4 X 90days = another year of service will get added on top of your existing 1-yr bundle -- all for free, with the $80 rewards points.

    That's it! You'll have gotten the flip phone plus 2 years of service plus 1440 minutes,texts,MB for $30+tax.

    I think that's a really great deal, especially since it really helps me out too when someone uses my referral code! So thanks if you choose this option!
    You can activate new service on Tracfone and get $80 by using my referral code (you get 8,000 rewards points - that's $80 in service or brand new phone!) You'll also get great karma! Not supposed to post referral codes out on the forum so please PM me for code. Thank you!

  11. #41
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    Isn't contacts stored on the sim card exclusively an AT&T feature now that was phased out with newer smartphones? AT&T seems to be having a bit of operational difficulty recently.

    Instead of giving up on Redpocket, maybe you could switch to a newer phone? I think you'll have the same problem with any AT&T based mvno. Staying on 4g sim might be just a stop gap too. Carrier are always upgrading their towers and old Sims can stop working.

    You can also use a different carrier under Redpocket. Verizon or T-mobile.

    Sent from my motorola one 5G UW ace using HoFo mobile app

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by sillyette View Post
    I think that's a really great deal, especially since it really helps me out too when someone uses my referral code! So thanks if you choose this option!
    Thanks for the info sillyette, much appreciated. If I choose this option I will definitely obtain and use your referral code. I've bookmarked your post so I can easily find my way back here.

    It does seem like a great deal, so I'll study it further.

    The posted reviews don't look great honestly, but it's hard to know what that means given there are bad reviews for every product on the Internet. My needs are pretty basic, so if I can talk and text I'll be happy.

  13. #43
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    There is probably an interest in keeping sim cards as cheap as possible, so there is no point in providing extra blank space for contacts. The phone and sd cards are much more suitable as storage locations, and also more flexible, as they can also store photos and other things and cross-reference between categories.

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShredFred View Post
    Instead of giving up on Redpocket, maybe you could switch to a newer phone?
    That's a possibility. I only have $22 invested in this phone, so it wouldn't be a crisis to let it go. I'll most likely get a new phone whatever happens next.

    At the moment I'm waiting to see if RedPocket will take responsibility for providing me with incorrect information when I purchased their SIM. That could definitely happen, but so far I have no evidence that it will. I've requested a refund, and am awaiting their reply on that. If they issue the refund without further hassle, I'll keep an open mind about trying them again.

    To be fair to RedPocket, they do respond to my communications, usually within 24 hours. Thumbs up for that, much better than my experience at H20. The RedPocket website is better too. The activation process was pretty arcane, but they do make a good faith effort to document it, and provide help links throughout. The price for their SIM seems reasonable to me.

    My concern so far is that:

    1) They provided me with false information at the point of sale. I think it was an honest mistake on their part. They just didn't know about this incompatibility. Ok, so we all make mistakes, I'm cool with that. But...

    2) So far, they not acknowledged or taken any responsibility for their mistake. My best guess at the moment is that they're trying to blow me off, but I'd like to be wrong about that.

    All RedPocket had to say to keep my business for years to come was this:

    "Whoops, we're sorry, we didn't know about the incompatibility between our SIM and your phone. We didn't mean to give you wrong information. We can't obtain the 4G SIM your phone requires, but we could sell you a different phone, or if you prefer, provide you with a refund."
    Not so hard, eh?

  15. #45
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    RedPocket support is completely hopeless. Steer clear of this company folks, they don't stand behind their statements or their products. There's no point in sending them your personal experience with their products, documented facts, contact info for phone makers, links to ATT support forum, screen shots of exactly what they previously told you, or any of that. Redpocket support simply ignores anything they don't want to hear, so it's not possible to have a constructive conversation with them.

    The only way to fix this is to never contact RedPocket in the first place.

    Lesson learned, my education continues.

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