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Thread: Verizon CBRS auction failure

  1. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by kevink1 View Post
    The Mercator projection. I didn't realize the US was that close to the size of Canada

    I haven't seen all that much of Canada. Vancouver and southern BC. And another trip from Idaho to Calgary then back to US via Glacier National Park. And a day excursion into the Yukon.
    If you exclude Alaska the US is 83.6% that of Canada

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    Quote Originally Posted by JoeInPa View Post
    Although that’s possible the few articles I did find regarding xfinity and their CBRS plans all related to using it as offload for cellular to lower data fees to Verizon.
    Depending on the market Comcast could choose to lease it to Verizon if Verizon felt it might need some exclusive spectrum. For example in my state it's mostly either Comcast or Charter except Comcast has the urban areas. Memphis, Nashville, Chattanooga. While Charter is mainly the rural areas. Verizon didn't get any CBRS in these areas and I can see where possibly there might not be much CBRS to share in Memphis or Nashville.

  3. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hagar View Post
    Depending on the market Comcast could choose to lease it to Verizon if Verizon felt it might need some exclusive spectrum. For example in my state it's mostly either Comcast or Charter except Comcast has the urban areas. Memphis, Nashville, Chattanooga. While Charter is mainly the rural areas. Verizon didn't get any CBRS in these areas and I can see where possibly there might not be much CBRS to share in Memphis or Nashville.
    In dense areas a lease may be more practical but where the area gets more rural that’s where it gets grey. If I was Verizon and I was in a little more rural setting I wouldn’t pay for spectrum I could use for free.

    It would be very expensive for Comcast or charter/spectrum to actually put up a cellular network and it will take quite a while to do so. And then it would just be small pockets.

    I haven’t looked into charter/spectrum mobile much but I know xfinity mobile has been vocal that they been very happy with their relationship with Verizon but they are always looking at ways to lower the data costs they pay to Verizon.

    I also imagine the experience for the xfinity mobile end user on its own network wouldn’t be all that spectacular. In my market xfinity has a little 600 MHz spectrum and the 2 PEA’s of CBRS they just acquired. I would imaging going to something like a sporting event or being downtown with potentially 1000’s of other users on a 20 MHz chunk of spectrum wouldn’t exactly be blazing fast. Now if xfinity or spectrum/charter gave Verizon access to that spectrum in exchange for lower data rates it would be a win for both companies. Verizon could add the 600 MHZ spectrum to macro sites giving it a little better range than band 13 with some added capacity and they could add The CBRS PAL’s to urban/small cell sites and they could add more small cells or strand mounted cell sites in residential at a lower cost and faster rate giving Verizon better coverage and capacity then they could do in their own all while saving xfinity and charter/spectrum money they pay to Verizon for data charges.



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  4. #139
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    Also on a side note I would love for the FCC to put some sort of spectrum squatting law in place for all spectrum that is similar to how CBRS is managed.

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    Also on a side note I would love for the FCC to put some sort of spectrum squatting law in place for all spectrum that is similar to how CBRS is managed.
    Indeed. They should make sure it's conservative especially on low band (I wouldn't want to lose any TV stations for "white space" usage, and obviously licensed users should not be interfered with at all; also it's better to not have unlicensed users interfere either); probably in places like New York and LA this will not open up anything. But there's loads of unused spectrum in loads of the country, it'd open it up for a local WISP (wireless ISP) or someone to use it.

  6. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoeInPa View Post
    In dense areas a lease may be more practical but where the area gets more rural that’s where it gets grey. If I was Verizon and I was in a little more rural setting I wouldn’t pay for spectrum I could use for free.
    Once again you assume there will actually be free spectrum to use. Sure in a lot of area maybe not others. if an area happens to not have a lo of free spectrum then leasing might not be a bad idea especially since the lease should be cheap

    It would be very expensive for Comcast or charter/spectrum to actually put up a cellular network and it will take quite a while to do so. And then it would just be small pockets.

    I haven’t looked into charter/spectrum mobile much but I know xfinity mobile has been vocal that they been very happy with their relationship with Verizon but they are always looking at ways to lower the data costs they pay to Verizon.
    You kind of contradict yourself. first you say Verizon would never lease spectrum then you suggest Charter and Comcast lease spectrum to Verizon to offset data costs

    I also imagine the experience for the xfinity mobile end user on its own network wouldn’t be all that spectacular. In my market xfinity has a little 600 MHz spectrum and the 2 PEA’s of CBRS they just acquired. I would imaging going to something like a sporting event or being downtown with potentially 1000’s of other users on a 20 MHz chunk of spectrum wouldn’t exactly be blazing fast.
    You forget that Xfintiy uses Verizon network.

    Now if xfinity or spectrum/charter gave Verizon access to that spectrum in exchange for lower data rates it would be a win for both companies. Verizon could add the 600 MHZ spectrum to macro sites giving it a little better range than band 13 with some added capacity and they could add The CBRS PAL’s to urban/small cell sites and they could add more small cells or strand mounted cell sites in residential at a lower cost and faster rate giving Verizon better coverage and capacity then they could do in their own all while saving xfinity and charter/spectrum money they pay to Verizon for data charges.
    If Verizon was interested in 600 MHz the would have bought some already



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  7. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoeInPa View Post
    Also on a side note I would love for the FCC to put some sort of spectrum squatting law in place for all spectrum that is similar to how CBRS is managed.
    All spectrum licenses have build out requirements. This is not new. Spectrum has been taken away form companies in the past for not following the buildout requirements. Not sure how some extra law will help and also not interfere with said buildout requirements

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    Verizon CBRS auction failure

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hagar View Post
    Once again you assume there will actually be free spectrum to use. Sure in a lot of area maybe not others. if an area happens to not have a lo of free spectrum then leasing might not be a bad idea especially since the lease should be cheap
    Well as of now no one really has much CBRS equipment up and running in the wild (other than Verizon) so yeah it will be a while until it’s in use. Absolutely when you are in dense urban setting in a few years unused CBRS may be hard to come by but I highly doubt that rural CBRS spectrum will fill up for quite a while

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hagar View Post
    You kind of contradict yourself. first you say Verizon would never lease spectrum then you suggest Charter and Comcast lease spectrum to Verizon to offset data costs
    I definitely could have worded that better. What I’m saying is that Verizon would likely not lease it if they aren’t getting something else out of the deal (IF THEY HAD OTHER OPTIONS) Yes in a large city I could see them leasing some CBRS spectrum from dish so they have guaranteed spectrum access but in a rural setting their will be much less competition for CBRS use. In this case they could also share deployment costs and network resources.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hagar View Post
    you forget that Xfintiy uses Verizon network.
    I’m aware of this. I was referring to if xfinity had its own mobile core infrastructure, towers, and equipment and they weren’t using Verizon’s. The articles I saw about Xfinity referred to them having their own network/equipment running on an esim and then falling back to Verizon when their network was unavailable.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hagar View Post
    If Verizon was interested in 600 MHz the would have bought some already
    [/QUOTE]

    Yes that is true but my point was that if they could gain access to unused dormant spectrum and put it to use that would be a good thing.

    Now obviously I’m not a Verizon engineer nor a Verizon business analysis/ROI expert and this is just speculation but In the end by looking at how Verizon bid on CBRS it looks like Verizon is looking at CBRS spectrum as a way to tide them over until they can get something else which I’m assuming is C-Band. I guess I really can’t blame Verizon for that. When you look at CBRS’s current range because of current power level restrictions and the advancement in mmWave range through things like beam forming and such maybe Verizon doesn’t see the value there if CBRS is only going a 1/2 mile or so further than mmWave so when you add the costs of equipment along with the ROI maybe Verizon just doesn’t see the value there on a national level but sure in a dense large city CBRS makes sense.

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