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Thread: Now T-Mobile can give US a full 5G Nationwide Network with speed

  1. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by offthegrid View Post
    I can't see any circumstance under which a failed Dish would be allowed to fold into Tmobile given the entire reason for approval was them becoming a 4th carrier.
    Yep, failure of Dish to meet it's obligations would be a "can of worms". Many thought this would happen in the process of negotiations of the merger.

  2. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by offthegrid View Post
    I can't see any circumstance under which a failed Dish would be allowed to fold into Tmobile given the entire reason for approval was them becoming a 4th carrier.
    Times change. Give it a few years.

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    Quote Originally Posted by loboheeler View Post
    Yep, failure of Dish to meet it's obligations would be a "can of worms". Many thought this would happen in the process of negotiations of the merger.
    I don’t see how Dish can fail when they have more customers than US Cellular and Cspire combined after the Boost merger plus a low cost Roaming deal with T-Mobile for 7 Years. That is on top of Dish Satellite TV network revenue. Charlie Ergen didn’t become a multi-Billionaire by being stupid.

    I fully expect Dish to merger with US Cellular since the other networks including Dish will eat them alive since USCC, Cspire and Rural Network must have roaming from the Big 3 Networks nationwide to keep their customers. Plus Dish can pick up some of the rural networks in the process. Dish can lease spectrum to T-Mobile or other networks to reduce Dish proaming costs. Wouldn’t be surprised if Ergen cut a deal with billionaire Carlos Slim that owns America Movil that operates in 18 countries including TracFone, Net10, Straight Talk, Page Plus, Telcel and Walmart Family Wireless. America Movil also owns the largest mobile network in Mexico and has about 25 MVNO customers in the USA.
    Last edited by shilohcane; 04-09-2020 at 02:24 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DRNewcomb View Post
    What @jakeuten says. And I don't have any special insider information into the inner workings of T-Mobile. I've just watched them for many years. Their first priority is going to be dealing with existing towers. New coverage is pretty far down the list. Not saying it won't happen. I just wouldn't bet on it.
    Except T-Mobile has service here thus they have existing towers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jet1000 View Post
    That would be great if Dish fell through and T-Mobile got to keep that spectrum and those customers too.
    If Dish fails to meet it's obligations, their spectrum will be taken by the FCC and re-auctioned where anyone can buy it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hagar View Post
    If Dish fails to meet it's obligations, their spectrum will be taken by the FCC and re-auctioned where anyone can buy it.
    The penalty for not building out the 5G network that was part of the T-Mobile/Sprint deal, is not loss of spectrum. It's only a $2.2 billion penalty:

    "Dish must build a 5G network that covers 20% of the U.S. population by 2022 and 70% by 2023. It will have to pay a $2.2 billion penalty to the U.S. Treasury if it can’t reach its goal."

    https://www.cnbc.com/2019/07/26/dish...s-network.html

  7. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by jet1000 View Post
    The penalty for not building out the 5G network that was part of the T-Mobile/Sprint deal, is not loss of spectrum. It's only a $2.2 billion penalty:....
    But is this in place of or in addition to the many other deadlines for which they've begged extensions and other relief?
    Donald Newcomb

  8. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by shilohcane View Post
    I don’t see how Dish can fail when they have more customers than US Cellular and Cspire combined after the Boost merger plus a low cost Roaming deal with T-Mobile for 7 Years. That is on top of Dish Satellite TV network revenue. Charlie Ergen didn’t become a multi-Billionaire by being stupid.

    I fully expect Dish to merger with US Cellular since the other networks including Dish will eat them alive since USCC, Cspire and Rural Network must have roaming from the Big 3 Networks nationwide to keep their customers. Plus Dish can pick up some of the rural networks in the process. Dish can lease spectrum to T-Mobile or other networks to reduce Dish proaming costs. Wouldn’t be surprised if Ergen cut a deal with billionaire Carlos Slim that owns America Movil that operates in 18 countries including TracFone, Net10, Straight Talk, Page Plus, Telcel and Walmart Family Wireless. America Movil also owns the largest mobile network in Mexico and has about 25 MVNO customers in the USA.
    There are likely a few companies that Dish might be able to make a deal with -- part of why T-Mobile wanted limits on who Dish could partner with in rolling out their network. Beyond the ones you mentioned, it is possible that they could partner would someone like Amazon, there have been rumors of Amazon wanting a "Prime Mobile" service. Another possibility is with one of the cable companies, such as Xfinity or Spectrum, who would rather have their own network rather than continuing to be a Verizon MVNO.

    It did seem clear, when Dish made the deal to buy Boost, that they were planning to bring in another company as a partner, it will be interesting to see what happens.

  9. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hagar View Post
    If Dish fails to meet it's obligations, their spectrum will be taken by the FCC and re-auctioned where anyone can buy it.
    My personal thought, should Dish at some point forfeit all their spectrum back to the FCC, is that the government would attempt to sell all Dish's spectrum to a company willing to build the 4th national mobile network.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jet1000 View Post
    The penalty for not building out the 5G network that was part of the T-Mobile/Sprint deal, is not loss of spectrum. It's only a $2.2 billion penalty:

    "Dish must build a 5G network that covers 20% of the U.S. population by 2022 and 70% by 2023. It will have to pay a $2.2 billion penalty to the U.S. Treasury if it can’t reach its goal."

    https://www.cnbc.com/2019/07/26/dish...s-network.html
    So does anyone know if Dish has started building out there current spectrum in volume yet? Remember last year that Dish was building out a IoT network that really was just a Safety Network to stop the FCC from taking their spectrum..

    Has anyone on this board worked with Dish Network on this new wireless network?


    Dish has said it will spend between $500 million and $1 billion through 2020 building out the first phase of its wireless network. The company plans to initially deploy an NB-IoT network and cover 70% of the population by March 2020. The phase 2 build-out will require a new process of RFPs.“. https://www.fiercewireless.com/wirel...-first-for-u-s

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    Quote Originally Posted by DRNewcomb View Post
    But is this in place of or in addition to the many other deadlines for which they've begged extensions and other relief?
    This is specifically the penalty for not building out their network. I haven't seen that the agreement to build out the network changed any of the conditions to their spectrum purchases. However, it wouldn't surprised me if Dish got some adjustments to those for agreeing to participate in this deal.

    Quote Originally Posted by mogelijk View Post
    My personal thought, should Dish at some point forfeit all their spectrum back to the FCC,
    Dish would never forfeit any spectrum. They would always sell it to someone at some price before forfeiting it.

    Quote Originally Posted by shilohcane View Post
    So does anyone know if Dish has started building out there current spectrum in volume yet? Remember last year that Dish was building out a IoT network that really was just a Safety Network to stop the FCC from taking their spectrum..

    Has anyone on this board worked with Dish Network on this new wireless network?


    Dish has said it will spend between $500 million and $1 billion through 2020 building out the first phase of its wireless network. The company plans to initially deploy an NB-IoT network and cover 70% of the population by March 2020. The phase 2 build-out will require a new process of RFPs.“. https://www.fiercewireless.com/wirel...-first-for-u-s

    Well that article was written in October 2018---well before the anti-merger forces caused the massive delay in the timetable. So assume not much will get built out in 2020 with the merger delay and also the virus could certainly cause some delay as well.

    The first step is for Dish to setup to be an MVNO. They said they could do it 30 days after the merger. That would consist of them selling Boost service to people (I assume they'd start by bundling with it with their TV packages). That's going to be the majority of their operation at first and why T-Mobile was concerned they'd bring in a deep pocketed partner because they could sell the T-Mobile network with no restrictions.

  12. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by jet1000 View Post
    This is specifically the penalty for not building out their network. I haven't seen that the agreement to build out the network changed any of the conditions to their spectrum purchases. However, it wouldn't surprised me if Dish got some adjustments to those for agreeing to participate in this deal. .
    Dish must have got a extension of their 70% build out requirement on some of their spectrum since the the FCC drop dead date to take back that spectrum was 9 days ago on April 1st.

    Quote Originally Posted by jet1000 View Post

    The first step is for Dish to setup to be an MVNO. They said they could do it 30 days after the merger. That would consist of them selling Boost service to people (I assume they'd start by bundling with it with their TV packages). That's going to be the majority of their operation at first and why T-Mobile was concerned they'd bring in a deep pocketed partner because they could sell the T-Mobile network with no restrictions.
    Dish has 90 days after the merger on April 1st to buy Boost Mobile. I have read that T-Mobile will not allow Boost to re-Sell T-Mobile Roaming. That T-Mobile roaming is for only Boost customers. So Dish can’t resell T-Mobile roaming to MVNO.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jet1000 View Post
    This is specifically the penalty for not building out their network. I haven't seen that the agreement to build out the network changed any of the conditions to their spectrum purchases. However, it wouldn't surprised me if Dish got some adjustments to those for agreeing to participate in this deal.



    Dish would never forfeit any spectrum. They would always sell it to someone at some price before forfeiting it.




    Well that article was written in October 2018---well before the anti-merger forces caused the massive delay in the timetable. So assume not much will get built out in 2020 with the merger delay and also the virus could certainly cause some delay as well.

    The first step is for Dish to setup to be an MVNO. They said they could do it 30 days after the merger. That would consist of them selling Boost service to people (I assume they'd start by bundling with it with their TV packages). That's going to be the majority of their operation at first and why T-Mobile was concerned they'd bring in a deep pocketed partner because they could sell the T-Mobile network with no restrictions.
    What you miss that, as was pointed out, Dish already missed the build out date for their previously owned spectrum -- that was April 1. Their agreement to purchase Boost extended the date -- but if they don't meet the terms of the agreement then the date will not be extended and they forfeit their spectrum. So basically, if Dish cannot meet its obligation, then the FCC will control Dish's current spectrum and work with T-Mobile to find someone to sale Boost Mobile to, likely including Dish's current spectrum (which they'll have forfeited) in the deal.

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    My neighbor has a Sprint iPhone 5s that I had initially thought would be toast, but maybe not. It may be able to run on TMO HSPA for voice if Sprint CDMA 1x is shut down. These have B2 and B4 for LTE data, and also B25 if they bring that over. Some older Sprint Androids may not have this capability.
    I hadn't even thought of that, but you're right.. many if not all of the "CDMA+LTE" android phones also have GSM/HSPA support, they may not have to replace much at all right away.
    Yep. Even less competition in wireless would be fantastic!
    As this merger is already showing, the notion that T-Mobile isn't going to compete is being debunked. T-Mobile now has the firepower to compete.
    The "even less competition" was with T-Mo also getting all the Dish spectrum, not with T-Mo/Sprint itself. I'd agree with that; I have no probelm with T-Mo getting Sprint's spectrum (that Sprint was really not using well), but I do like the idea of Dish getting something going and being a new 4th competitor rather than it just also going to T-Mo (who at this point has a pretty good amount of spectrum already anyway.)

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    Quote Originally Posted by mogelijk View Post
    What you miss that, as was pointed out, Dish already missed the build out date for their previously owned spectrum -- that was April 1. Their agreement to purchase Boost extended the date -- but if they don't meet the terms of the agreement then the date will not be extended and they forfeit their spectrum.
    You're correct. I found the detailed terms of the obligations and extensions on the FCC's website here:

    https://www.fcc.gov/sites/default/fi...r-07262019.pdf

    It's actually a pretty impressive build out they've committed to with big penalties for failure.

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