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Thread: What will a plan b look like if no sprint?

  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by elecconnec View Post
    "That was a joke, son..."

    I don't think a couple of million MVNO users are causing any significant headaches for Verizon.

    (Plus, I wonder how many of those 1.7 million disappear this month when Comcast forces the old free T&T plan customers onto the $12/month 1GB plan. I'm certainly dropping them like a stone!)

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    I'm pretty sure Verizon rather have those 2.5 million Xfinity and Spectrum customers be on actual Verizon since they would make much more money off them.

  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hagar View Post
    I'm pretty sure Verizon rather have those 2.5 million Xfinity and Spectrum customers be on actual Verizon since they would make much more money off them.
    But isn't that the MVNO conundrum in a nutshell? MVNOs exist to market to price sensitive consumers (hopefully) without eroding the value of the parent carrier's own product.

    I'm a happy T-Mo customer paying $125 for unlimited everything. I have one Verizon-based line on a "free" Xfinity Mobile number (I parked my old landline there to keep the number, but it gets used for only about 100 minutes a month.)

    I have no idea what Xfinity pays Verizon wholesale for my line and it's hundred minutes, so let's say for argument it's $2/month. Would Verizon rather have me as a $40/month Verizon customer than a $2 Xfinity customer? Sure. But is there a snowball's chance in Hades I'd ever give Verizon $40 (or even $20) a month for a low-use landline replacement? Nope.

    So Verizon's choice for me, and probably a good number of those 1.7 million customers, is to take the $2 (or whatever) from each of us, or get nothing, since if Xfinity Mobile didn't exist, we'd probably be on a different (and likely non-Verizon based) low-cost MVNO or carrier. (In fact, since Xfinity is killing the free lines next month, I'm currently weighing my options as to what service, if any, I'll move this number to. Guess what carrier has *zero* chance of getting my business due to their pricing?)

    So, is Verizon happier getting nothing at all from me come February, or for the $2/month they got from me from the birth of Xfinity Mobile until January 2020? My budget for this number is $5/month or less, so it's absolutely certain my next provider will not be Verizon proper, and most likely will not be a Verizon MVNO.

    (At that <=$5 price point, if it stays cellular, I'll probably have to be a Sprint MVNO like Tello or RedPocket, but realistically, I'll probably just spend $20 once and port the number to Google Voice and just forward it to my T-Mo number. The free Xfinity line cost me ~$2.50/month in taxes and fees, so the break-even is less than a year.)



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  3. #78
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    It's looking more and more like T-Mobile better have a plan B ready.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hagar View Post
    It's looking more and more like T-Mobile better have a plan B ready.
    Has anything changed since the end of oral arguments? Both sides had some time to submit statements before the judgment scheduled in March 2020.

    I assume, in the mean time, T-Mo and the state AGs are strategizing and/or discussing an out of court settlement that may or may not happen. Both sides may not want the uncertainty of the judge's verdict. We know that T-Mo has made deals with states no longer in the case. I have not hear anything about what the states remaining would settle for, and I would not expect to hear much until a deal was agreed or the judgment rendered.

    I am sure that T-Mo (and Sprint) had contingency plans from before the time the deal was announced. Both have made statements about how they might proceed if the deal is blocked.

    Meanwhile, as armchair business/industry analysts, we can argue the pros and cons of the deal without much new info. Our positions on the deal have been argued ad nauseam.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hagar View Post
    It's looking more and more like T-Mobile better have a plan B ready.
    I think that's the echo chamber you're hearing.
    Donald Newcomb

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    Quote Originally Posted by DRNewcomb View Post
    I think that's the echo chamber you're hearing.
    Like everybodies saying that?
    Or there's no answer?
    If my actions include deeds of philanthropy in charity and acts of loving kindness I am living in my Faith.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bobdevnul View Post
    Meanwhile, as armchair business/industry analysts, we can argue the pros and cons of the deal without much new info.
    I am cautiously optimistic that the merger may or may not go through...and am taking a wait and see approach.

    https://www.businessinsider.com/mean...-smart-2014-12



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    Quote Originally Posted by techfranz View Post
    I am cautiously optimistic that the merger may or may not go through...
    I predict with 100% certainty that it will be one of those 2 options

  9. #84
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    I have been a Cellular->Sprint post-paid customer for 20 continuous years. Sprint’s coverage in MN is decent although there are no coverage pockets here and there. These no coverage pockets expand where one must ride on or rely on roaming agreements.

    T-Mobile has the same issue - simply looking at their own maps. One of the two carrier may have coverage in one area while the other has limited to no coverage.

    Having a combined network (with some bands being sold) would be better for customers. If there are four national carriers and now two, how is that good for the consumer? I rather there be three good national carriers than two.

    As to price, consumers will generally pay more as time for on whether there are mergers or not. The plans may not be as robust. Every new technology gives carriers the opportunity to re-invent their plans and pricing structure - whether it is 2G, 3G, 4G LTE or the new entrant of 5G.

    The new technology gives consumers the opportunity to shop again and again - sometimes switching carriers from one frying plan to another.

    The bottom lines for me are sustainability, reliability and effective competition where going from 4 to 3 is more competition than 4 to 2.

    The price will be the price. Choice is key for what a consumer 1) needs and ultimately wants, and 2) is willing to pay.

    Mergers, integrations and consolidations are no panacea. They never happen with a signature and a flip of a switch. Setting expectations for what the competition is and what the consumer experience is will take at least two if not up to four years. Lights out for one carrier could take just a few days.

    My point is that a consolidation of two struggling carriers into one powerhouse will be much better for consumers to compete with the other two - even though it take 2-4 years to experience the full transition.


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    Quote Originally Posted by gdrenick74 View Post
    The bottom lines for me are sustainability, reliability and effective competition where going from 4 to 3 is more competition than 4 to 2...


    My point is that a consolidation of two struggling carriers into one powerhouse will be much better for consumers to compete with the other two - even though it take 2-4 years to experience the full transition.
    Interesting perspective. My only real issue with it is your assumption that T-Mobile is a "struggling carrier."

    While T-Mo doesn't have the size or coverage of the big two, it is by no means struggling. It's had explosive growth compared to the other three carriers and enjoys a high level of customer satisfaction and low churn. Sprint may be struggling, but T-Mo isn't, and has admitted in the merger process that they expect their coverage and customer growth to continue without the merger, just not at as quick a pace as they would with Sprint's assets.

    My argument has always been, and continues to be, that unevenly-sized carriers are a better instrument for competition, as the smaller carriers are forced to offer lower prices and/or other perks (e.g. free international roaming, included Netflix, or unlimited music streaming) to attract consumers to a service that's otherwise inferior in other metrics. Just as Frontier or Spirit airlines can offer cheaper tickets in return for fewer routes, no free baggage allowance and a lack of creature comforts, a wireless carrier that doesn't cover East Cowtown, Nebraska or Dirt Alley, Oklahoma can offer lower prices to customers who never travel there.

    My fear is that three strong carriers with relatively equal size and coverage will eventually work much like the current duopoly does towards each other, and gravitate towards lock-step pricing and features, except there won't be any smaller, scrappier carriers to challenge the status quo like T-Mo (and Sprint) do currently.



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  11. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by elecconnec View Post
    Interesting perspective. My only real issue with it is your assumption that T-Mobile is a "struggling carrier."

    While T-Mo doesn't have the size or coverage of the big two, it is by no means struggling. It's had explosive growth compared to the other three carriers and enjoys a high level of customer satisfaction and low churn. Sprint may be struggling, but T-Mo isn't, and has admitted in the merger process that they expect their coverage and customer growth to continue without the merger, just not at as quick a pace as they would with Sprint's assets.

    My argument has always been, and continues to be, that unevenly-sized carriers are a better instrument for competition, as the smaller carriers are forced to offer lower prices and/or other perks (e.g. free international roaming, included Netflix, or unlimited music streaming) to attract consumers to a service that's otherwise inferior in other metrics. Just as Frontier or Spirit airlines can offer cheaper tickets in return for fewer routes, no free baggage allowance and a lack of creature comforts, a wireless carrier that doesn't cover East Cowtown, Nebraska or Dirt Alley, Oklahoma can offer lower prices to customers who never travel there.

    My fear is that three strong carriers with relatively equal size and coverage will eventually work much like the current duopoly does towards each other, and gravitate towards lock-step pricing and features, except there won't be any smaller, scrappier carriers to challenge the status quo like T-Mo (and Sprint) do currently.



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    A lot of common sense spoken, yet the majority on here still thinks otherwise. More choices via more competitors is always good for the consumer. Yet some still try and put a spin on this and say otherwise, probably brainwashed or have their own agenda.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Limeybastard View Post
    A lot of common sense spoken, yet the majority on here still thinks otherwise. More choices via more competitors is always good for the consumer. Yet some still try and put a spin on this and say otherwise, probably brainwashed or have their own agenda.

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    So if we had 10 carriers that would be better? Where is the spectrum coming from? That's the difference between a carrier and a burger joint. There's not really a limited supply of meat. So yeah you can have all sorts of burger franchises

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    What will a plan b look like if no sprint?

    My apologies regarding T-Mo. Nothing negative intended. They simply do not have the coverage in out-state MN (beyond Twin Cities). Combining resources and assets can result in a much more competitive carrier.

    In terms of tens of carriers, we have seen that before and it does not work out that well. Monopolies and duopolies should be avoided or heavily regulated which most are (or least were).

    Telecom / Digital Media carriers are a lot like airline carriers. There is limited bandwidth and limited airspace. Competition is good but don’t be ignorant about it either. Three can be much better than four if we ultimately would end up with two.




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    Last edited by gdrenick74; 01-10-2020 at 09:39 AM.

  14. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by gdrenick74 View Post
    My apologies regarding T-Mo. Nothing negative intended. They simply do not have the coverage in out-state MN (beyond Twin Cities). Combining resources and assets can result in a much more competitive carrier.

    In terms of tens of carriers, we have seen that before and it does not work out that well. Monopolies and duopolies should be avoided or heavily regulated which most are (or least were).

    Telecom / Digital Media carriers are a lot like airline carriers. There is limited bandwidth and limited airspace. Competition is good but don’t be ignorant about it either. Three can be much better than four if we ultimately would end up with two.




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    No offense taken. I'm just a T-Mo customer, not a principal. I don't really have a dog in this fight.

    Your particular circumstance (living in an area where T-Mo's service is crap or non-existant) gives you a different perspective on the company. I'm lucky to live in an area where T-Mo service is excellent for the most part, but I'm occasionally reminded when traveling that's not always the case!



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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hagar View Post
    So if we had 10 carriers that would be better? Where is the spectrum coming from? That's the difference between a carrier and a burger joint. There's not really a limited supply of meat. So yeah you can have all sorts of burger franchises
    Agreed. If 4 is better than 3, then 10 is better than 4. So why aren't they advocating that they use the anti-trust laws to break AT&T and Verizon apart. Force them to divest assets to companies U.S. Cellular, Shentel and C Spire. Give Dish some AT&T and Verizon assets too. They could use them.

    If competition is king, lets get 8 nationwide network competing against each other.

    Quote Originally Posted by gdrenick74 View Post
    Monopolies and duopolies should be avoided or heavily regulated which most are (or least were).

    Telecom / Digital Media carriers are a lot like airline carriers. There is limited bandwidth and limited airspace. Competition is good but don’t be ignorant about it either. Three can be much better than four if we ultimately would end up with two.
    Great points. Hopefully the merger will go through so that the new T-Mobile will be another strong competitor in Minnesota to the areas you mentioned. It's very elitist of New York and California to say only their residents matter and to heck with the citizens of Minnesota. That's the point that the DOJ and the FCC made at the end of the merger trial---that they have reviewed all of the information and this is the best decision for the entire country and not just the small areas that the attorney generals are focused on.

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