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Thread: New "smartsim" service from Tracfone.

  1. #46
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    The thing for Google FI is that the experiment will end if the merger is approved because within a year or so afterwards there will be no Sprint signal to latch onto.

    The experiment was always about licensing the tech out anyway since Google never had the existing customer base to get decent wholesale rates.

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    Quote Originally Posted by offthegrid View Post
    The thing for Google FI is that the experiment will end if the merger is approved because within a year or so afterwards there will be no Sprint signal to latch onto.
    Yep, Sprint is going to loose either way. If the merger goes through the CDMA network will be eliminated after a while, just like when T-Mo bought MetroPCS a few years ago. This will also affect Boost being sold to Dish, as the plan is to run it on T-Mo. If it does not go through, Sprint will fail economically, and have to pull back service to (urban) markets that can sustain a smaller company. This has all come out in the merger trial recently.

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    Quote Originally Posted by loboheeler View Post
    Yep, Sprint is going to loose either way.
    State AGs would rather Sprint fold than merge.
    I done see them surviving with just urban coverage.

    TMO is only slightly better off. Their cut rate pricing is boosting customers but not really a plan long term profitability.

  4. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by ST Dog View Post
    State AGs would rather Sprint fold than merge.
    I done see them surviving with just urban coverage.

    TMO is only slightly better off. Their cut rate pricing is boosting customers but not really a plan long term profitability.
    Looks like at least the end of Feb. for a court decision about the merger.

    TMO has bet their "cookies" on 5G which is not going to pay off any time soon. There is little millimeter-wave spectrum operating, and that will be restricted to urban areas. Very few phones available yet, and none affordable.

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    Quote Originally Posted by loboheeler View Post
    TMO has bet their "cookies" on 5G which is not going to pay off any time soon. There is little millimeter-wave spectrum operating, and that will be restricted to urban areas.
    5G/mm-wave only works in urban areas where you can have a dense arrays if transceivers. Big metros. Even small cities will not be viable for decades if ever (not enough users to recover the costs to install/maintain). Towns and rural areas I don't see ever getting coverage.

    So if TMO bets the farm on 5G they are going to be even more limited than they are now. It's WiMAX all over. That worked out so well for Sprint...

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    Quote Originally Posted by ST Dog View Post
    5G/mm-wave only works in urban areas where you can have a dense arrays if transceivers. Big metros. Even small cities will not be viable for decades if ever (not enough users to recover the costs to install/maintain). Towns and rural areas I don't see ever getting coverage.
    Agree, everybody that knows anything agrees mm-wave 5G will never come to low usage areas. Yet, government officials in unaffected areas are in panic that this will be forced on them. The information about 5G is very poor to the general public.

  7. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by ST Dog View Post
    So if TMO bets the farm on 5G they are going to be even more limited than they are now. It's WiMAX all over. That worked out so well for Sprint...
    Does not sound good to me, and both TMO and Sprint may go down in flames.

  8. #53
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    New "smartsim" service from Tracfone.

    Quote Originally Posted by ST Dog View Post
    So if TMO bets the farm on 5G they are going to be even more limited than they are now. It's WiMAX all over. That worked out so well for Sprint...
    Can’t compare 5G NR with WiMAX because 5G NR is being used on all four major carriers, as well as it being a globally deployed standard. Qualcomm is forcing the standard on its modems and chipsets. AT&T is already working on its multilayer setup, refarming low band for 5G NR for greater coverage while slowly expanding mmWave. Verizon is in a spectrum crunch, so their multilayer setup has to wait until they shut down CDMA later this year and/or until the next sets of spectrum auctions. However they have the capital to get it done quickly.
    DSS will further make deployment easier while retaining the current LTE networks where needed.

    Sprint is the only one with a real problem. They haven’t deployed on spectrum besides mmWave, and they don’t have the capital to deploy on unused spectrum without major financial support. This was Sprint’s problem a few times before, by being late to adopt more globally compatible standards (LTE and more recently VoLTE), racking up debt to catch up, and needing to continue legacy standards (CDMA is considered legacy now).
    Last edited by Haas_Dave; 01-21-2020 at 08:14 AM.
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  9. #54
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    I saw a T-Mo commercial claiming nationwide 5G.

    But more details at https://adage.com/article/digital/t-...-blitz/2219216 and https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...reless-service don't make it sound quite as appealing.

    And https://arstechnica.com/information-...ion-americans/ says "T-Mobile's "nationwide 5G" isn't nationwide and is just barely faster than 4G" and "T-Mobile today announced that it has launched "America's first nationwide 5G network," but T-Mobile's definition of "nationwide" doesn't include about 40% of the US population."

    So...

  10. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boz1 View Post
    I saw a T-Mo commercial claiming nationwide 5G.
    T-Mobile is using legal advertising terms.
    "Nationwide" as an advertising term only relates to covering population size. Having the ability to cover 200 million people is the current baseline for legitimately claiming "National," "Nationwide" or "Coast to coast" per the National Advertising Division of the BBB.

    I feel the baseline needs to be changed, closer to 300 million as that covers ~90% of the US population. That is a bit optimistic, though.


    That said, yes T-Mobile's n71 network doesn't cover a good chunk of people right now but it does cover more than other 5G deployments. LTE had similar growing pains when carriers first deployed it.
    Speeds: the same was said for AT&T's 5G NR on low band.
    Both of these growing pains will be remedied over the next several years, through additional spectrum auctions, refarming and utilizing DSS.



    Relating to the original topic: if TracFone wants this smartsim product to suceed, they should get it in the market while LTE is still the dominate standard and OEMs make carrier-agnostic devices.
    OEMs will likely continue to carrier-agnostic LTE support, but most will initially develop carrier-specifc 5G variants to save money on R&D. TracFone could force carrier agnostic 5G devices into the market with a product like smartsim.

    Sent from my HD1905 using Tapatalk

  11. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haas_Dave View Post
    Can’t compare 5G NR with WiMAX because 5G NR is being used on all four major carriers, as well as it being a globally deployed standard. Qualcomm is forcing the standard on its modems and chipsets.
    We shall see.

    WiMAX was adopted by many companies in well over 100 countries. It's an IEEE standard.

    Qualcomm can push all they want, doesn't mean it will be meaningful for most of the population nor does it have a chance to save TMO.

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    Sprint was forced into WiMax due to a use it or lose it clause regarding their band 41 because LTE wasn't ready yet and regardless of whether it was any good or not Sprint was dead *** broke prior to SoftBank investing in them so they never really wanted to grow it anyway.

    If there's no merger they return to the same financial status as before SoftBank invested. SoftBank stopped new investment some time ago. Sprint started getting all new money outside of recurring revenue from unsecured junk bonds with high interest rates. If there's no merger with the specter of bankruptcy hanging over Sprint unsecured junk bond financing ends.

    If the merger is denied Sprint immediately declares bankruptcy.

  13. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by offthegrid View Post
    If the merger is denied Sprint immediately declares bankruptcy.
    Leaving 3 carriers, just what the AGs are complaining about if the merger is allowed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ST Dog View Post
    Leaving 3 carriers, just what the AGs are complaining about if the merger is allowed.
    Absolutely agree there.

    Sprint is honestly THE business school text book case for the worst managed business in history.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Haas_Dave View Post
    Verizon is in a spectrum crunch, so their multilayer setup has to wait until they shut down CDMA later this year and/or until the next sets of spectrum auctions.
    If my local conditions are an indication, than Verizon is indeed running out of capacity. For the last couple of years here they have been mostly using B4/66 and the signal is rarely better than -105dBm. On the few occasions when I see B5 or B13 the signal is usually better than -95dBm.

    What is worthwhile in spectrum auctions? When Sprint folds by the merger or bankruptcy, it's spectrum is fairly worthless by anybody else.

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