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Thread: Why is Verizon requiring CDMA phones when it is shutting it down?

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    Why is Verizon requiring CDMA phones when it is shutting it down?

    Why is Verizon requiring CDMA phones when it is shutting it down and is 100% LTE-A now? I would like to stay with Verizon when I visit the US but unsure exactly where in Colombia I will be spending most of my time. I will be buying a Note 8 or Note 9.

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    You'll need CDMA in order to roam on certain Verizon partner coverage.

    But FWIW, they do do CDMA-less activations for some devices. They have to whitelisted or certified by Verizon to work.
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    They do activations of non-CDMA phones. OnePlus 6T and OnePlus 7 Pro are great examples.


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    Quote Originally Posted by IT_Architect View Post
    Why is Verizon requiring CDMA phones when it is shutting it down and is 100% LTE-A now? I would like to stay with Verizon when I visit the US but unsure exactly where in Colombia I will be spending most of my time. I will be buying a Note 8 or Note 9.
    They don't require CDMA there are at least a half dozen phones they sell on their own website that lack CDMA

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    Quote Originally Posted by Haas_Dave View Post
    You'll need CDMA in order to roam on certain Verizon partner coverage..
    Verizon does NOT require CDMA

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    Why is Verizon requiring CDMA phones when it is shutting it down?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hagar View Post
    Verizon does NOT require CDMA
    If you roam on, for example US Cellular or Sprint (yes it’s rare but it does happen), you will need CDMA still.

    It’s not required to use Verizon, but having a CDMA&VoLTE phone will still be an advantage until we get non-Verizon VoLTE roaming.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jakeuten View Post
    They do activations of non-CDMA phones. OnePlus 6T and OnePlus 7 Pro are great examples.
    My son has an iPhone X he ported in from T-Mobile, and it appears as "CDMA-LESS". I am not sure that it really does lack CDMA, but that's what the system thinks. All Verizon services such as VoLTE work fine.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CharlesH View Post
    My son has an iPhone X he ported in from T-Mobile, and it appears as "CDMA-LESS". I am not sure that it really does lack CDMA, but that's what the system thinks. All Verizon services such as VoLTE work fine.
    The iPhones from the 7 through the X came in 2 variants. One that supported CDMA and one that didn't. If the system reports CDMA-LESS, then it likely is the one that doesn't support it.

    Both variants work on ATT and T-Mobile without issue, so which purchased for T-Mobile likely depends on where it was purchased.
    iPhone X is my current primary phone. I have older model iPhones and Moto phones available on other lines. Currently prepaid, though would consider postpaid on right plan.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Haas_Dave View Post
    You'll need CDMA in order to roam on certain Verizon partner coverage. But FWIW, they do do CDMA-less activations for some devices. They have to whitelisted or certified by Verizon to work.
    Quote Originally Posted by jakeuten View Post
    They do activations of non-CDMA phones. OnePlus 6T and OnePlus 7 Pro are great examples.
    Thank you

    Quote Originally Posted by Haas_Dave View Post
    If you roam on, for example US Cellular or Sprint (yes it’s rare but it does happen), you will need CDMA still.It’s not required to use Verizon, but having a CDMA&VoLTE phone will still be an advantage until we get non-Verizon VoLTE roaming.
    Will the Verizon phone do LTE-A standard aggregation and VoLTE on non-Verizon networks?

    Thanks

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    Quote Originally Posted by Haas_Dave View Post
    If you roam on, for example US Cellular or Sprint (yes itÂ’s rare but it does happen), you will need CDMA still.

    ItÂ’s not required to use Verizon, but having a CDMA&VoLTE phone will still be an advantage until we get non-Verizon VoLTE roaming.
    Verizon has AT&T UMTS roaming for devices without CDMA, so CDMA is not required even for roaming.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jack4 View Post
    Verizon has AT&T UMTS roaming for devices without CDMA, so CDMA is not required even for roaming.
    This is all useful information. Verizon talks about how phones because technically they work, they may not be allowed on their network until they have been proven. I wonder where that list is?

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    Will the Verizon phone do LTE-A standard aggregation and VoLTE on non-Verizon networks?
    For now, there are still areas where VZW roams 1x only on US Cellular even though both 3g and 4g are available; in those cases the answer is of course "no." In the more usual case of 4G LTE roaming being available, as far as I know it will be LTE-A and VoLTE assuming the network and phone support it. *HOWEVER*, look at the details of your plan; on mine, all domestic roaming data is throttled to "2g speed" (128kbps.) LTEiRA roaming partners are considered native coverage, but any additional LTE coverage would not be. Not that it happens that often, but it's going to be a real bummer down the road in those US Cellular areas to get a nice LTE signal instead of 1x, but only have speeds improve from ~80-120kbps I get on 1x to a "solid" 128kbps. Oh well.

    Verizon has AT&T UMTS roaming for devices without CDMA, so CDMA is not required even for roaming.
    Indeed, VZW appears to be rather agressive about this; if you pull up the coverage map for "4G LTE devices without CDMA" it actually shows slightly more coverage than the regular 4g/3g/1x coverage map. I suppose VZW wants to as much as possible avoid the "the new technology has less coverage than the old one" problem, so they are being pretty agressive with picking up roaming agreements from GSM/UMTS-based carriers that historically would have been incompatible with CDMA phones.

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    Got it! I'm glad I asked. I learned a lot more, and things work in a lot more ways than I expected. So basically, because the Verizon network stops using CDMA doesn't mean it will never be used if it finds another CDMA network The new phones with both CDMA and GSM-type protocols, those GSM-type protocols will enable those phones to roam on AT&T's network domestically and foreign if the frequencies are there. However, I do not see CDMA support on on AT&T phones, so they would only be able to roam LTE the Verizon network. However, with LTE-A, I would think there would be a very strong incentive for carriers to ditch LTE and earlier in favor of LTE-A and newer. At that point you have standardized VoLTE, aggregation, HD Voice, to where all data is digitized into IP packets.

    They say that just because it is technically possible, that you can run a phone on their network, and that it has to be tested. I wonder if that list is available anywhere.

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    People noted in OnePlus forums, as well as in other HF communities w.r.t. the “CDMA-less certified” OnePlus 6t and 7 Pro (latter of which I am researching for my next possible device):

    CDMA-less devices on Verizon MVNOs (and even some of Verizon’s prepaid setups) are having issues difficult to fix by end users. I’m reading numbers of users end up having call, text and data issues. Most have to [have their MVNO’s CS] call Verizon directly to attempt enabling CDMA-less provisioning.

    It appears Verizon currently restricts/denies most CDMA-less activations outside of their own branded services. They may even block Visible which is odd since it is Verizon-owned. Maybe this will change before Jan 1st, but my guess is it will be a slow process.

    I have yet to read if Xfinity/Spectrum Mobile will activate a OnePlus 6t or 7 Pro directly, as they both are Verizon MVNO partners with postpaid plans. My guess is it hasn’t been tried because of their very limited BOYD programs.

    Add in that most US-bound flagship smartphones will still be using Qualcomm-based chipsets next year, CDMA will still be an option backed in.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jack4 View Post
    Verizon has AT&T UMTS roaming for devices without CDMA, so CDMA is not required even for roaming.
    I totally forgot about UMTS roaming for CDMA-less certified devices. I modified your quote to reflect that some locations it might be Commnet (Choice Wireless) or Cellular One (Alta Communications), examples of which have an active LTE agreement and operate both UTMS and CDMA networks.

    Unless I missed a press release or announcement somewhere, I don’t believe Verizon and AT&T have a roaming agreement nationwide or one that covers in-market overlaps. I imagine Verizon prefers to buy roaming coverage from a local/rural carrier rather than AT&T or even T-Mobile. Give roaming revenue to some small carrier, maybe they’ll become more susceptible to a buyout...

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