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Thread: How Exactly Will AT&T Remain Competitive?

  1. #391
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    Quote Originally Posted by zephxiii View Post
    Given that you were trying to indicate AT&T little 3G by calling it only "some", the comparison to Sprint's 3G foot print was in context. So given that this is a discussion, I can bring Sprint in for comparison in this situation.

    And yes, you often show that you are in a bind or angry at the whole situation.
    AT&T does, in fact, have "some" 3G, as opposed to the opposite word, "none". Neither are words of comparison, which would be something like "less" or "smaller". The use of the word "some" is not a comparison term.

    I have no clue what you are talking about in regards to the word "bind". It suggests I am in a difficult situation or something. Whatever, I don't care. I am upset with AT&T, based on my past experience as I said. Have I moved on? Yes, but that does not preclude me from stating my opinions on them or if I'm asked, making recommendations to others based on my experience. If you think that is wrong, I'm sorry.

  2. #392
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    Quote Originally Posted by zephxiii View Post
    Also why are you caring so much about marketing? All marketing is a crock of ****. You are wasting your time. I don't buy into any of it from any carrier or company and quite frankly i am not going to get all caught up giving a **** about what the average joe may think.
    Marketing is a big deal because companies spends tens of billions on it each year. While you may not care, or you may "know the truth" behind the marketing, the average joe doesn't. They see a commercial on TV and believe that is gospel. That's why political ads work.

    It's like that old advertising saying...."people don't know what they want until you tell them what they want".

  3. #393
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    Quote Originally Posted by GSMinCT View Post
    T-Mobile is just sad, as they are blatantly lying about the largest 4G network. At least AT&T and Verizon each tell the truth according to their own definition.

    AT&T is doing LTE because their network in some markets is so overloaded on the 3G/FauxG side that it's crumbling. I.e. Manhattan. It's sad that they didn't invest in Faux G to make it work at the time though. If they had 100% HSPA+/EB by the end of the year, they would be competing well with Verizon, and could even market "two types of 4G", which doesn't mean much, but sounds good to average Joe who doesn't know anything about wireless.
    But where T-Mobile has service, it is quite good. Using NYC as an example, they absolutely kill AT&T on the HSPA+ front. The sad part is it falls apart once you go more than 20-25 miles outside of NYC.

  4. #394
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    I wonder if the "native 3G everywhere" argument is a misnomer, however.

    Even Verizon has 1X cells floating out there, and large amounts of area that do not show up on a coverage map as 1X that are 1X. Study Kahoka, MO.



    That pink is a Verizon 1X cell. I would love to take a day and stake this puppy out and see what kind of backhaul is out there and maybe figure out why VZW never upgraded it to 3G. It's about a 5 hour drive from Southern Illinois. There are still plenty of areas where VZW falls to native 1X not shown on a coverage map much closer to me, like large chunks of Perry County, MO.

    What AT&T does need to do is upgrade areas where they have lots of customers still on EDGE. Areas like NE Michigan and West OK would fit that. Still let's look at the spectrum and backhaul in each of the rural areas that AT&T still serves with EDGE. Some of the areas where AT&T has 700 but no CLR are areas where AT&T should just wait for LTE save for populated areas where they can strategically fill in cells to add service. VoLTE and 12 MHz of rural spectrum would work well.

    I suspect the Rogers City issues in expansion are in part due to Frontier not being able to backhaul properly because their infrastructure is so gutted. I know. I see it living in a Frontier area myself. Verizon is dealing with this by running their own fiber into Randolph County. This has pushed our LTE deployment back to near the end. In fact I don't think VZW will be able to meet the June 30, 2013 target for all their native 3G network to be overlaid because the rural backhaul issues are a problem. December 2013 is still the realistic target. LTEiRA areas are still going to expand their footprint, however. In fact I wish LTEiRA deals would be cut with providers around me.

    Also consider USCC, I think it would be highly advisable for AT&T to consider an LTE partnership with them. Band 12 support isn't that big of a thing. Maybe even a merger of AT&T and USCC, I know the Carlsons will want BIG BIG MONEY but to have them on the AT&T board would be a stabilizing influence and a voice for rural customers.
    Have you read the forum rules lately?

  5. #395
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    Quote Originally Posted by jseah View Post
    Marketing is a big deal because companies spends tens of billions on it each year. While you may not care, or you may "know the truth" behind the marketing, the average joe doesn't. They see a commercial on TV and believe that is gospel. That's why political ads work.

    It's like that old advertising saying...."people don't know what they want until you tell them what they want".
    And that's why I don't care, as i don't want any of it in my mind thus I will not worry about it...at the same time I understand it's necessity to sell sell sell and bring in the money....that doesn't mean I have to care about how exactly they go about it...cuz i don't want to.

    Quote Originally Posted by jseah View Post
    But where T-Mobile has service, it is quite good. Using NYC as an example, they absolutely kill AT&T on the HSPA+ front. The sad part is it falls apart once you go more than 20-25 miles outside of NYC.
    Yes tmobile's HSPA network is great....when u can get it. I'd love to see them expand it to 100% of their native network...but they are way behind.
    iPhone 4 on AT&T:


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  6. #396
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    Quote Originally Posted by fraydog View Post
    Also consider USCC, I think it would be highly advisable for AT&T to consider an LTE partnership with them. Band 12 support isn't that big of a thing. Maybe even a merger of AT&T and USCC, I know the Carlsons will want BIG BIG MONEY but to have them on the AT&T board would be a stabilizing influence and a voice for rural customers.

    I would welcome such a merger! My only question would be are the two networks compatible?
    I'm caught in a trap. I can't walk out!

  7. #397
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    I drove up to the new VZ cell site in Rogers City and found out they are using Charter Communication's fiber for backhaul. Even snapped a pic. They just threw the fiber in the woods lol.



    Which makes me wonder, why can't AT&T piggy back off of Charter's fiber? If VZ can do it, so should they. But instead, they are relying on Frontier's crappy copper network.


    Sent from my iPhone 4S using Tapatalk
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  8. #398
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    They would just convert USCC equipment over to HSPA like they did with Alltel.

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    I figure the lte upgrades should start rolling faster for att sometime in 2013. I still think they have taken a temporary lte backseat for two reasons, first they do have good 3G speeds, and second, they just blew 3-4b with the tmobile deal. The tmo deal seemed to set them back a little. Maybe 2013 will be different.

  10. #400
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    Quote Originally Posted by zephxiii View Post
    They would just convert USCC equipment over to HSPA like they did with Alltel.
    Yes but they'd also be able to use existing LTE deployments, USCC would give them a LOT of spectrum headroom to be able to use PCS LTE in addition to AWS and 700.

    Sprint should consider making a run at USCC, if for no other reason than to make AT&T overpay.

  11. #401
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    Stop trying to give them ideas for acquisitions. Let them develop their own network. Or roam. We need more competition, not less. On the other hand I'm not against companies sharing infrastructure. It makes no sense for T-Mobile and Sprint LTE not to share enhanced core networks and NV basestations. Or Cricket and Sprint. Or MetroPCS and Sprint.

    Oh heck, Verizon has 4, count them 4 Internet backbone networks. They are just now getting around to consolidating them into one MPLS network.

  12. #402
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigsnake49 View Post
    Stop trying to give them ideas for acquisitions. Let them develop their own network. Or roam. We need more competition, not less. On the other hand I'm not against companies sharing infrastructure. It makes no sense for T-Mobile and Sprint LTE not to share enhanced core networks and NV basestations. Or Cricket and Sprint. Or MetroPCS and Sprint.

    Oh heck, Verizon has 4, count them 4 Internet backbone networks. They are just now getting around to consolidating them into one MPLS network.
    I doubt they need to read Howard Forums to get ideas for acquisitions.

    That said, I only said that an LTE partnership was advisable at this point, due to the incompatible nature of technology they use at this point. When everything is LTE the rules obviously change.

  13. #403
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    Quote Originally Posted by jseah View Post
    Michigan is a huge state. AT&T didn't even roll out 3G to the upper peninsula until the spring of 2011.
    AT&T doesn't give a crap about size apparently. Not too long ago (thinking 1.5 years ago or so) they didn't even have 3G at Cedar Point. you can imagine how useful EDGE was there :P I'm assuming they'd have 3G there now, but haven't looked.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jseah View Post
    But where T-Mobile has service, it is quite good. Using NYC as an example, they absolutely kill AT&T on the HSPA+ front. The sad part is it falls apart once you go more than 20-25 miles outside of NYC.
    While Verizon has 4G LTE that's great in the city, and soon they will have it over 100% of their footprint.

    AT&T and USCC is a great idea, adding CLR support up in northern New England would be great.

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