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Thread: Project #RogersSMS - CCTS Complaint re Rogers re SMS Fee Hike

  1. #1
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    Arrow Project #RogersSMS - CCTS Complaint re Rogers re SMS Fee Hike

    The Twitter-friendly short link to this #RogersSMS page is:
    http://bit.ly/h6O3sm

    Acronym definitions are here:
    s://RogersWatch.wordpress.com/Acronyms

    For anyone arriving at this page who doesn't know the background, this thread has it (esp the first post):
    http://www.howardforums.com/showthre...PPU-Text-Rates

    In short: Rog is once again jacking their rates, this time for PPU and overage SMS messages (from 15c ea to 20c ea) for everyone who:
    A) has an SMS add-on; or
    B) has no SMS plan, package or add-on; or
    C) has a contracted plan that specifically includes a non-unlimited number of SMS sent msgs

    However IMO cx's who are on contract don't have to accept this hike and can tell Rog to cram it.

    This post is an overview of how to stand up for your rights and pushback on Rog's latest, rapacious fee hike by filing a complaint with the CCTS - "Commissioner for Complaints for Telecommunications Services", since RogersElise's post makes it clear that Rog does not feel, in general, that Rog is obliged to keep the original fee.

    Even if you don't use SMS much or think that this fee hike will boost your bill I'd suggest pushing back at Rog for 2 reasons:
    - there's a good chance you'll get an unlimited SMS plan put on your account, for no extra cost to you, and
    - with near certainty, Rog will be soon be trying to jack a fee that will impact you, so cx's might as well get Rog used to cx's using the CCTS to resist Rog's never-ending fee hike and service reductions. Hopefully Rog will then think twice next time about jacking the rates for customers on contract, or reducing the service provided to them.


    What is "Project #RogersSMS"?

    Just my name for trying to raise awareness of this latest gouge by Rog. I've proposed that cx's email CCTS on one single day, Thursday Jan 20, to file their complaint (however any cx can 'repudiate' the fee hike to Rog up to 30 days after the cx is notified, which will be in your bill, likely in the "Bulletin Board" section, that is dated between approx Jan 16 and Feb 16). If you haven't 'repudiated' the fee hike, within 30 days after you have been notified in your bill it, then you have implicitly accepted it pursuant to the ToS and CoC.

    I've used the twitter hashtag #RogersSMS for 2 reasons:
    - the Rog social media team was incepted in the bowels of Twitterville, so this is an implicit taking of the 'public awareness battle' to their turf, and
    - it's a specific invitation to those who use Twitter to spread the word there with this as a suggested hashtag.

    If you don't do twitter it's no matter - everyone can use these instructions to pushback to Rog's fee-hike attempt.


    So let's begin...

    First, an apology for the size of this - I've tried to address most every reasonably-expected situation and explain things as I go along, and brevity is just not in my genes : )

    So, who should use this SMS-fee-hike CCTS complaint template?
    #1) you must be a post-paid cx, on a Rog contract
    #2) you do not have an unlimited number of SMS-sent msgs as part of your plan, or add-on (this obviously includes cx's with NO SMS plan or add-on)

    (I have 3 templates for the 3 slightly different classes of cx; see below.)

    Overview of steps:
    - You'll call Rog to seek remedy for this proposed fee hike
    - Rog will tell you to get lost
    - you will then file a complaint with CCTS
    - CCTS will investigate
    - CCTS will, I expect, rule in your favour (if Rog doesn't just capitulate first)
    =============================================

    Info you'll need to complete the CCTS complaint:

    - your NAME (or name of your business if the cell account is a small business account)
    - the rogers CELL NUMBER
    - the ADDRESS under which your Rogers account is listed
    - your contract START_DATE and END_DATE (ask Rog for this info when you call to seek remedy from them)
    - (optional) REFERENCE NUMBER from your call to Rog to try to resolve this
    =============================================

    Step 1:

    You have to contact Rog at least once to try to remedy this before you can file a CCTS complaint, so make that call and expect Rog to deny you your rights. Here are my instructions for how to handle that:

    - Call Rog at 888-764-3771
    - give the rep your account info so they can pull it up
    - ask for a REFERENCE NUMBER for the call at the very beginning, so you don't forget to do this
    - then...
    --- tell the CSR that you 'repudiate' this upcoming SMS-fee-hike (a unilateral contract change to a material term of your service), and that
    --- you require one of 3 things be done (Rog gets to choose which, BTW!) to remedy this:
    ------ for the remainder of your Contract, to be left on your original service whereby SMS overage rates are 15c ea, or
    ------ for the remainder of your Contract, to be offered some no-extra-monthly-fee change to your SMS text plan so that you won't ever have any SMS overages and thus suffer from the fee-hike, or
    ------ to [email protected]=$0 (including porting your number to another carrier if that is your wish)

    - When the rep refuses you all of these thank them and conclude the call. (You don't need to debate or argue with the rep - just tell them what you want and if they don't promptly agree with one of the 3 proposed remedies you've suggested then that's all that you need to move on to the next step.)

    BTW, if Rog offers to have a manager call you back, or tells you to contact some "Management Office", OoP, or somesuch tell them that you're not willing to do that - you politely but firmly insist that the matter be resolved in that one call that you are making, and not dragged on for hours, days or weeks while Rog waffles and avoids.

    CCTS seems to be acutely aware of the nuisance/tactic of a cx having to make multiple calls to resolve an issue, as they described in their most recent Annual Report, related to Porting hassles (pdf pg 30: "There is no reason for a customer to have to make more than one call, or to pay two providers for the same month’s service"), so my take is: basically, if Rog does not 100% agree to one of your 3 offered remedies in that ONE call, for ANY reason, you can take that as a "No" response from Rog and have thus met the CCTS requirement of having made a "reasonable attempt" to resolve the matter directly with your carrier.


    Step 2:

    Email your complaint to CCTS (this address: [email protected]) by copying & pasting from the appropriate template.

    After this post I will follow up with 3 more, each of them being a template for an email complaint to CCTS that should be used by a specific type of Rog cx, depending of how SMS usage is setup for your account.

    The 3 types of affected cx are:
    --------------------------------
    Type A) You have a voice plan with Rog that is under contract and you have an SMS-addon that gives you a fixed number of sent-SMS msgs per month

    Type B) You have a voice plan with Rog that is under contract and you have NO SMS-addon whatsoever (meaning you pay 15c for every sent SMS msg and 15c for every received SMS msg)

    Type C) You have a voice + SMS plan with Rog that is under contract and that voice + SMS plan specifically includes some fixed (not unlimited!) number of sent-SMS msgs per month

    If you're not sure what SMS usage is on your account call Rog (888-764-3771) and ask them some simple YES/NO questions:
    ---- can you send unlimited SMS msgs per month with no overage fees; if YES then ignore this whole issue entirely and go home, since it doesn't impact you at all; if NO...
    ---- do you pay for every SMS msg sent; if YES then you are Type B; if NO then...
    ---- is your SMS an add-on, or part of your contracted voice plan; if YES then you are Type A; if NO then you are Type C

    So now you know which email template to use!

    IMO it is preferable that you email your complaint to CCTS instead of phoning it in, since if a bunch of us call in then the CCTS phone reps might get swamped and we don't want to do that to them. However if you must you can phone in your complaint at this number:
    888-221-1687
    which is open M-F, 9-5, Eastern time.

    You can also use the CCTS complaint webform (but I hate these webform things, personally):
    https://www.ccts-cprst.ca/en/complaints/complaint-form

    I think that CCTS has that form since so many people would email them with incomplete info. But since I've 'templated' all the required info hopefully this email will work just as well for them.

    So then you personalize the email you intend to send (search for instances of *** to see what needs editing) and fire it off.

    Now wait...


    Step 3:

    What to expect after your complaint is filed....

    AIUI CCTS should contact you back to acknowledge your complaint and ask for any missing or unclear info. They might get busy this week : ) so hopefully you'll hear back from them no later than the middle of next week.

    Once CCTS has all the required info they'll pass along your complaint to Rog and thereafter Rog is required to:
    a) within 15 calender days (from Rog's receipt of the complaint) contact both you and the CCTS to explain why they think the complaint is without any CCTS-purview, or lawful, merit (in CCTS parlance this is an "Objection"); or

    b) within 30 calender days (from Rog's receipt of the complaint) communicate to both the cx and to CCTS that the matter remains "Unresolved"; or

    c) within 30 calender days (from Rog's receipt of the complaint) communicate to both the cx and to CCTS that the matter is now "Resolved" to the satisfaction of both Rog and the cx.

    If Rog "Objects" to the complaint we'll see what CCTS has to say, based on the reasons that Rog provides, and cross that bridge when we get there.

    If Rog "Resolves" the complaint to your satisfaction then great ... that's all you wanted in the first place.

    If Rog doesn't resolve the complaint to your satisfaction then we'll follow that through as necessary, based on Rog's response - I'll be keeping an eye on things hopefully (time permitting).


    Step 4:

    The aftermath...

    This will be an interesting issue to see how CCTS handles it - Rog will surely lean on the 'saving clause' of the CoC to avoid responsibility here (except in the case of Type-B and Type-C cx's since both these classes of cx have, IMO, a 100% indisputably legitimate complaint - Type A I'm only 97% certain about).

    If people have success or failure with this remedy pursuit, and would like to share their experience with others but do so anonymously, they can send me emails or scans of any documents and if you require I'll assist in redacting your personal info or verifying that your own redaction has been complete (in my own, very 'paranoid' eyes : ) and then, at your choice, you can post it publicly or I will (in order to preserve your anonymity).


    Closing:

    A) If it sounds like I'm not, myself, going to pursue this with Rog so you might reasonably wonder why - the reason is this:
    If I do pursue it (and publicly so state) then that would help Rog narrow down which of their cx's is that pest (to them : ) BellVictim/RogersWatch, the identification of which would help them divest themselves of me as a cx since there's no doubt in my mind that RCI, as a corporate organ, would love to be rid of me.

    So basically I'm not saying that I will or that I won't follow my own advice (or 'eat my own dog-food' as the expression goes), and so Rog may or may not wish to conclude that one of the people who sends off an included template is me.

    I hope that the kind readers can understand why I'm not being more clear about my own intent here.

    B) Generally, I discourage people from PM'ing me for personal assistance since if I give bad/wrong advice in a PM there's nobody else reading it to correct it, and also other people can't benefit from my response to you nor the outcome of your own experience ... so please, unless absolutely necessary, post to the forum instead of PM'ing me : )

    This obviously does not include if you want to get in touch with me to have me redact/verify-redactions of your info, in advance of publication.

    C) Don't count on being able to achieve [email protected]=$0 by using this SMS-fee-hike as a fulcrum; IMO:
    ---- i) it is Rog's choice, about which of the 3 remedies you indicate will satisfy your issue, they wish to implement, and
    --- ii) it is obviously in Rog's interest to just give you free unlim SMS sending, vs letting you escape the noose via [email protected]=$0

    So good luck folks!

    And once again, props to WorldIRC for bringing this issue to everyone's attention!

    Knowledge is power ... and ain't the internet a super-cool force-multiplier!!!

    BTW: Suggestions for improvement or clarification are most welcome and I'll edit my posts based on good ideas.

    BTW: If you want to reply and quote my post PLEASE trim off the excess!

    PS: Elise, way to throw gasoline on the whole issue with that downright odious, so-called 'response' you gave to my questions : (

    #RogersSMS
    Last edited by BellVictim; 01-25-2011 at 04:19 PM. Reason: mention the CCTS email addy - doh!

  2. #2
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    Exclamation Type A - SMS Add-On

    Below is the email template for Type-A cx's (those who have an SMS add-on that is not part of the contracted voice service

    To:
    [email protected]

    Subject:
    Complaint re SMS fee hike re Rogers Wireless [Type A]

    Body:
    CCTS, first thank you so much for your work, and congratulations on your recent defeat of Rogers' attempt to kill your organization at the CRTC review!

    Next, my information related to my Rogers cell service:
    Account name: ***MY_PERSONAL_NAME or ***MY_SMALL_BUSINESS_NAME
    The Rogers cell #: ***CELL_NUMBER
    Which is a ***PERSONAL/***BUSINESS line
    The address of record for this account is: ***STREET, ***CITY, ***PROVINCE, ***POSTAL_CODE
    My current contract with Rogers started in ***MONTH of ***YEAR and is set to expire in ***MONTH of ***YEAR.

    The SMS-usage status of my account is: [type A] I have a FIXED number of SMS message in my non-contract add-on that I can send each month, before incurring surcharges.
    --------------------------

    I became aware of this issue on or about ***Jan 15, 2011.

    There are no other organizations, which have the authority to compensate me for losses, currently helping me resolve this.

    For follow-up communications related to this complaint please contact me at ***FILL_IN_ONE_OR_BOTH:
    9-5 Eastern phone number: ***OPTIONAL__PHONE_NUMBER
    or
    email at: ***OPTIONAL__EMAIL_ADDRESS

    The nature of my complaint is a contract dispute.

    ***VERIFY I have read the CCTS Privacy Policy at:
    https://www.ccts-cprst.ca/en/privacy-policy
    and agree to its terms.

    ***VERIFY I have read and agree to be bound by the CCTS Procedural Code found at:
    https://www.ccts-cprst.ca/wp-content...roc_Code_1.pdf
    and agree to its terms

    ***VERIFY I attest that I am the person, or have authority to represent the person/company, related to this Rogers account


    --------------------------
    --------------------------
    Complaint details:
    --------------------------
    As part of my service from Rogers I have a limited number of SMS messages I can send as part of my monthly allotment, before I have to pay per-use overage charges, and that overage (pay-per-use) charge was 15c ea when I signed up for my contract.

    I have recently become aware of Rogers' intent to, on Mar 16, raise the rate they charge for sent SMS messages, that are in excess of my monthly limit, to be 20c ea.

    I consider this to be an unfavourable change to the terms of my Rogers service and don't want to suffer any negative economic or usability consequence due to this price hike, compared to the costs I would have incurred if the rate stayed at 15c ea as when I signed my contract.

    On ***DATE I called Rogers to attempt to resolve this issue (***OPTIONAL_CALL_REFERENCE_NUMBER) and I thus informed Rogers that I do not accept their unilateral change to the terms of my Rogers service and I proposed that Rogers select from one of 3 reasonable remedies to remedy this:
    a) for the remainder of my Contract that I be permitted to stay on the original price that was in effect at the time of inception of my contract, being 15c ea for SMS messages in excess of my monthly allotment, or
    b) for the remainder of my Contract that my account be configured so that I have an unlimited number of sent SMS messages (which would thus avoid the in-excess-of-monthly-allotment issue entirely) at NO additional monthly cost to me, or
    c) I be permitted to cancel my service without having to pay any Early Cancellation Fee (and to port my number to a different carrier if that is my wish)

    However during that call Rogers refused to implement any of my 3 proposed remedies and thus I find myself with no recourse but to file a complaint with CCTS in order that you may assist me in resolving this issue fairly.


    Argument details:
    --------------------------
    I am aware of the CWTA's Code of Conduct, that Rogers is an undersigned, and that the CCTS upholds carriers to any such industry Codes of Conduct.

    The CWTA Code includes the following "promise":
    ========================
    Protect our customers’ rights when we must change contract terms

    We do not change the material terms of our contracts with customers, without giving them at least 30 days’ notice. In the case of such material changes that are unfavourable to customers, we either give them the right to terminate the contract without any additional fees for early termination, or allow them to remain on the unchanged contract. This does not apply to changes that are required by law or regulation or changes to those services and features that do not have a fixed term commitment.
    ========================

    I would point out that:
    a) a fee hike is obviously a material change, and
    b) a fee hike is obviously an unfavourable change

    So this issue meets these tests.

    The final issue here, however, is that my SMS service is not itself part of the Contracted services - it is an add-on that ostensibly could be severed (cancelled) from the Contracted portion of my service while leaving the Contracted portion intact.

    In light of this I anticipate that Rogers will attempt to employ this 'saving clause' of their Code's promise to absolve themselves here of an obligation to remedy, and to suggest that if I don't like the SMS fee hike I can just cancel my SMS service (yet still leaving me chained to the Contracted, voice service).

    However this is clearly not a reasonable solution for me since in order to regain SMS service from another carrier I would suffer the following unfavourable, substantial harms:
    - I would have to acquire an SMS-only plan from another carrier (at a likely substantial monthly cost, well above what I presently pay for my SMS service that is coupled with my current Rogers voice service), and
    - I would have to acquire another phone (again at a significant cost), and
    - I would have to carry 2 phones with me at all times (and own and house their chargers and accessories, etc), and
    - I would have to have a separate phone number for sending/receiving SMS messages, compared to making/receiving voice calls, that I would have to communicate to all my contacts and hope that they can keep track of which phone number of mine to use for SMS communication and which to use for voice communication, and
    - I would have to duplicate my contact list from one phone to the other, and be diligent about updating them both when a contact was added or changed

    So for those reasons I consider the so-called 'option' to cancel my now-more-costly SMS service with Rogers, and replace it with service from another carrier, as, from a both economic and practical standpoint, wholly unworkable and thus wholly unreasonable.

    And even if I were to sever my SMS add-on and use Rogers' pay-per-use SMS service I would fall back to the pay-per-use SMS rate, which at the time of the inception of my contract was 15c ea however I would be forced to start paying 20c ea as of Mar 16, despite my voice service having been, at the time of my contract's inception, coupled with pay-per-use SMS rates of 15c ea and that this pay-per-use rate was entirely a part of my contracted voice service.

    For these reasons I hope that the CCTS will see that the costs I expected to pay for my whole, cellphone communications service that I agreed to, and accepted from Rogers at the inception of my contract - including both the 'contract-bound' voice service and the non-contract-bound SMS service (or even pay-per-use SMS rates) have been materially and unfavourably changed by Rogers' intended attempt to unilaterally change both the PPU and overage SMS fees, and that moving my SMS service to another carrier is, by any rational measure, a neither feasible nor reasonable solution.

    Furthermore, I would posit that even though I may not at this time approach using my full allotment of SMS messages I can not predict what my future needs will be and thus wish to protect myself from all contingencies.

    And still furthermore, the value of my Contract (i.e. selling it on the open market pursuant to a TOR - Transfer of Responsibility) is in part hinged upon both the recurring fees rate and overage fees rate of my Contract, and that by my overage and Pay-per-use SMS fee raising to 20c ea the value of my Contract, if sold, would be reduced by Rogers' proposed fee hike.


    Resolution sought:
    --------------------------
    In light of this I ask that the CCTS require that Rogers accept, at their discretion, any of the 3 remedies which I have proposed so as to nullify this fee-hike change to the services I receive from Rogers, and not force me to accept the harms caused by replacing just the SMS service I receive from Rogers with that from another carrier, nor the devaluation of my Contract's resale value that would flow from a hike to my overage rates.


    Closing:
    --------------------------
    I thank you for your consideration of this matter.

    If any further information or details are required of me please feel to contract me via the means indicated at the top of this contact, and I look forward to a response from CCTS and/or Rogers about how we can resolve this in a fair and reasonable way.

    And thank you, CCTS, for being an option to resolve this impasse between us!

    Kindest Regards,
    *** YOUR_NAME
    Last edited by BellVictim; 01-25-2011 at 05:01 PM. Reason: mention the CCTS email addy - doh!

  3. #3
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    Exclamation Type B - NO SMS Add-On or Plan Component

    Below is the email template for Type-B cx's (those who have no SMS add-on or plan component)

    To:
    [email protected]

    Subject:
    Complaint re SMS fee hike re Rogers Wireless [Type B]

    Body:
    CCTS, first thank you so much for your work, and congratulations on your recent defeat of Rogers' attempt to kill your organization at the CRTC review!

    Next, my information related to my Rogers cell service:
    Account name: ***MY_PERSONAL_NAME or ***MY_SMALL_BUSINESS_NAME
    The Rogers cell #: ***CELL_NUMBER
    Which is a ***PERSONAL/***BUSINESS line
    The address of record for this account is: ***STREET, ***CITY, ***PROVINCE, ***POSTAL_CODE
    My current contract with Rogers started in ***MONTH of ***YEAR and is set to expire in ***MONTH of ***YEAR.

    The SMS-usage status of my account is: [type B] I have no SMS add-on and there is no allotment of SMS msgs that is part of my contracted service; therefore I always the pay-per-use rate for every SMS msg sent and received.
    --------------------------

    I became aware of this issue on or about ***Jan 15, 2011.

    There are no other organizations, which have the authority to compensate me for losses, currently helping me resolve this.

    For follow-up communications related to this complaint please contact me at ***FILL_IN_ONE_OR_BOTH:
    9-5 Eastern phone number: ***OPTIONAL__PHONE_NUMBER
    or
    email at: ***OPTIONAL__EMAIL_ADDRESS

    The nature of my complaint is a contract dispute.

    ***VERIFY I have read the CCTS Privacy Policy at:
    https://www.ccts-cprst.ca/en/privacy-policy
    and agree to its terms.

    ***VERIFY I have read and agree to be bound by the CCTS Procedural Code found at:
    https://www.ccts-cprst.ca/wp-content...roc_Code_1.pdf
    and agree to its terms

    ***VERIFY I attest that I am the person, or have authority to represent the person/company, related to this Rogers account


    --------------------------
    --------------------------
    Complaint details:
    --------------------------
    As part of my service from Rogers I have a limited number of SMS messages I can send as part of my monthly allotment, before I have to pay per-use overage charges, and that overage (pay-per-use) charge was 15c ea when I signed up for my contract.

    I have recently become aware of Rogers' intent to, on Mar 16, raise the rate they charge for sent SMS messages, that are in excess of my monthly limit, to be 20c ea.

    I consider this to be an unfavourable change to the terms of my Rogers service and don't want to suffer any negative economic or usability consequence due to this price hike, compared to the costs I would have incurred if the rate stayed at 15c ea as when I signed my contract.

    On ***DATE I called Rogers to attempt to resolve this issue (***OPTIONAL_CALL_REFERENCE_NUMBER) and I thus informed Rogers that I do not accept their unilateral change to the terms of my Rogers service and I proposed that Rogers select from one of 3 reasonable remedies to remedy this:
    a) for the remainder of my Contract that I be permitted to stay on the original price that was in effect at the time of inception of my contract, being 15c ea for SMS messages in excess of my monthly allotment, or
    b) for the remainder of my Contract that my account be configured so that I have an unlimited number of sent SMS messages (which would thus avoid the in-excess-of-monthly-allotment issue entirely) at NO additional monthly cost to me, or
    c) I be permitted to cancel my service without having to pay any Early Cancellation Fee (and to port my number to a different carrier if that is my wish)

    However during that call Rogers refused to implement any of my 3 proposed remedies and thus I find myself with no recourse but to file a complaint with CCTS in order that you may assist me in resolving this issue fairly.


    Argument details:
    --------------------------
    I am aware of the CWTA's Code of Conduct, that Rogers is an undersigned, and that the CCTS upholds carriers to any such industry Codes of Conduct.

    The CWTA Code includes the following "promise":
    ========================
    Protect our customers’ rights when we must change contract terms

    We do not change the material terms of our contracts with customers, without giving them at least 30 days’ notice. In the case of such material changes that are unfavourable to customers, we either give them the right to terminate the contract without any additional fees for early termination, or allow them to remain on the unchanged contract. This does not apply to changes that are required by law or regulation or changes to those services and features that do not have a fixed term commitment.
    ========================

    I would point out that:
    a) a fee hike is obviously a material change, and
    b) a fee hike is obviously an unfavourable change

    So this issue meets these tests.

    Finally, my voice contract, at the time of inception, gave me access to pay-per-use SMS service of 15c ea but Rogers now wants to change that to 20c ea.

    Since access to this SMS service was a feature of my contracted 'voice' service it is inseverable from the whole, contracted service.

    Thus protection of my right to 15c SMS msgs is no less justifiable than my right to the original number of voice minutes that were part of my Contract.

    And still furthermore, the value of my Contract (i.e. selling it on the open market pursuant to a TOR - Transfer of Responsibility) is in part hinged upon both the recurring fees rate and pay-per-use fees rate of my Contract, and that by pay-per-use SMS fee raising to 20c ea the value of my Contract, if sold, would be reduced by Rogers' proposed fee hike.


    Resolution sought:
    --------------------------
    In light of this I ask that the CCTS require that Rogers accept, at their discretion, any of the 3 remedies which I have proposed so as to nullify this fee-hike change to the Contracted services I receive from Rogers, and not force me to accept the harm caused the devaluation of my Contract's resale value that would flow from a hike to my overage rates.


    Closing:
    --------------------------
    I thank you for your consideration of this matter.

    If any further information or details are required of me please feel to contract me via the means indicated at the top of this contact, and I look forward to a response from CCTS and/or Rogers about how we can resolve this in a fair and reasonable way.

    And thank you, CCTS, for being an option to resolve this impasse between us!

    Kindest Regards,
    *** YOUR_NAME
    Last edited by BellVictim; 01-25-2011 at 05:02 PM. Reason: mention the CCTS email addy - doh!

  4. #4
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    Exclamation Type C - SMS is Part of Whole, Contracted Plan

    Below is the email template for Type-C cx's (those who have an allotment of SMS msgs that is part of their contracted voice plan)

    To:
    [email protected]

    Subject:
    Complaint re SMS fee hike re Rogers Wireless [Type C]

    Body:
    CCTS, first thank you so much for your work, and congratulations on your recent defeat of Rogers' attempt to kill your organization at the CRTC review!

    Next, my information related to my Rogers cell service:
    Account name: ***MY_PERSONAL_NAME or ***MY_SMALL_BUSINESS_NAME
    The Rogers cell #: ***CELL_NUMBER
    Which is a ***PERSONAL/***BUSINESS line
    The address of record for this account is: ***STREET, ***CITY, ***PROVINCE, ***POSTAL_CODE
    My current contract with Rogers started in ***MONTH of ***YEAR and is set to expire in ***MONTH of ***YEAR.

    The SMS-usage status of my account is: [type C] I have an allotment of SMS msgs that I can send each month that is specifically a component of my contracted 'voice plan + SMS'
    --------------------------

    I became aware of this issue on or about ***Jan 15, 2011.

    There are no other organizations, which have the authority to compensate me for losses, currently helping me resolve this.

    For follow-up communications related to this complaint please contact me at ***FILL_IN_ONE_OR_BOTH:
    9-5 Eastern phone number: ***OPTIONAL__PHONE_NUMBER
    or
    email at: ***OPTIONAL__EMAIL_ADDRESS

    The nature of my complaint is a contract dispute.

    ***VERIFY I have read the CCTS Privacy Policy at:
    https://www.ccts-cprst.ca/en/privacy-policy
    and agree to its terms.

    ***VERIFY I have read and agree to be bound by the CCTS Procedural Code found at:
    https://www.ccts-cprst.ca/wp-content...roc_Code_1.pdf
    and agree to its terms

    ***VERIFY I attest that I am the person, or have authority to represent the person/company, related to this Rogers account


    --------------------------
    --------------------------
    Complaint details:
    --------------------------
    As part of my Contracted plan from Rogers I have a limited number of SMS messages I can send as part of my monthly allotment, before I have to pay per-use overage charges, and that overage (pay-per-use) charge was 15c ea when I signed up for my contract.

    I have recently become aware of Rogers' intent to, on Mar 16, raise the rate they charge for sent SMS messages, that are in excess of my monthly limit, to be 20c ea.

    I consider this to be an unfavourable change to the terms of my Rogers Contract and don't want to suffer any negative economic consequence due to this price hike, compared to the costs I would have incurred if the overage rate stayed at 15c ea as when I signed my contract.

    On ***DATE I called Rogers to attempt to resolve this issue (***OPTIONAL_CALL_REFERENCE_NUMBER) and I thus informed Rogers that I do not accept their unilateral change to the terms of my Rogers service and I proposed that Rogers select from one of 3 reasonable remedies to remedy this:
    a) for the remainder of my Contract that I be permitted to stay on the original price that was in effect at the time of inception of my contract, being 15c ea for SMS messages in excess of my monthly allotment, or
    b) for the remainder of my Contract that my account be configured so that I have an unlimited number of sent SMS messages (which would thus avoid the in-excess-of-monthly-allotment issue entirely) at NO additional monthly cost to me, or
    c) I be permitted to cancel my service without having to pay any Early Cancellation Fee (and to port my number to a different carrier if that is my wish)

    However during that call Rogers refused to implement any of my 3 proposed remedies and thus I find myself with no recourse but to file a complaint with CCTS in order that you may assist me in resolving this issue fairly.


    Argument details:
    --------------------------
    I am aware of the CWTA's Code of Conduct, that Rogers is an undersigned, and that the CCTS upholds carriers to any such industry Codes of Conduct.

    The CWTA Code includes the following "promise":
    ========================
    Protect our customers’ rights when we must change contract terms

    We do not change the material terms of our contracts with customers, without giving them at least 30 days’ notice. In the case of such material changes that are unfavourable to customers, we either give them the right to terminate the contract without any additional fees for early termination, or allow them to remain on the unchanged contract. This does not apply to changes that are required by law or regulation or changes to those services and features that do not have a fixed term commitment.
    ========================

    I would point out that:
    a) a fee hike is obviously a material change, and
    b) a fee hike is obviously an unfavourable change

    So this issue meets these tests.

    Finally, my voice contract, at the time of inception, included a fixed number of SMS msgs that I could send and any overage would be 15c ea, but Rogers now wants to change that to 20c ea.

    Since this SMS service was an actual feature of my contracted 'voice' service it is inseverable from the whole, contracted service.

    Thus protection of my right to 15c SMS msgs is no less justifiable than my right to the original number of voice minutes that were part of my Contract.

    And still furthermore, the value of my Contract (i.e. selling it on the open market pursuant to a TOR - Transfer of Responsibility) is in part hinged upon both the recurring fees rate and pay-per-use fees rate of my Contract, and that by pay-per-use SMS fee raising to 20c ea the value of my Contract, if sold, would be reduced by Rogers' proposed fee hike.


    Resolution sought:
    --------------------------
    In light of this I ask that the CCTS require that Rogers accept, at their discretion, any of the 3 remedies which I have proposed so as to nullify this fee-hike change to the Contracted services I receive from Rogers, and not force me to accept the harm caused the devaluation of my Contract's resale value that would flow from a hike to my overage rates.


    Closing:
    --------------------------
    I thank you for your consideration of this matter.

    If any further information or details are required of me please feel to contract me via the means indicated at the top of this contact, and I look forward to a response from CCTS and/or Rogers about how we can resolve this in a fair and reasonable way.

    And thank you, CCTS, for being an option to resolve this impasse between us!

    Kindest Regards,
    *** YOUR_NAME
    Last edited by BellVictim; 01-25-2011 at 05:03 PM. Reason: cosmetic1 + mention the CCTS email addy - doh!

  5. #5
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    Whew - nice to have one out of my craw!

    Some tangential thoughts:
    - Type A (SMS add-on) cx's are the only ones that do not, IMO, have a 100% rock solid case due to that 'saving clause' of the CoC (yet I think there are superior reasons nonetheless). But what if you could transform yourself from a Type A cx to a Type B (no SMS plan) who has IMO a 100% rock-solid case? Well, presumably you can - just call in and kill your SMS add-on. Then a few days later call Rog and complain that your PPU rate has gone from 15c to 20c, and you want the 15c back. Rog will probably offer to put you on some unlimited SMS plan, (remember: insist on NO additional monthly fee to you!) ... so in way you can drop your costs-something SMS plan and end up with unlim SMS, for free. There are 2 dangers here though: #1) if Rog instead keeps you on the existing 15c/msg PPU setup then you've lost your SMS plan and have to get it back, and as a condition of getting it back you might have to accept the upcoming 20c overage rate (which might not actually matter to you if you never go over), and #2) this is a bit of playing games, which I generally discourage. However you know that you've got a handle on the landscape when you can see the loopholes : )

    - I've included the "[Type X]" as part of the subject line for the CCTS emails, to assist them with differentiating the 3 types of affected cx's - we don't want them treating those 3 Types all the same and we do want to make it easy for them to do their job.

    Good luck folks!

  6. #6
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    Looks like I'll be giving Rogers a call after work! Anyone know much about Bell's data rate plans? Going to give them a shot and see if their coverage is better than Rogers in my area.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BellVictim View Post
    But what if you could transform yourself from a Type A cx to a Type B (no SMS plan) who has IMO a 100% rock-solid case? Well, presumably you can - just call in and kill your SMS add-on. Then a few days later call Rog and complain that your PPU rate has gone from 15c to 20c, and you want the 15c back. Rog will probably offer to put you on some unlimited SMS plan, (remember: insist on NO additional monthly fee to you!) ... so in way you can drop your costs-something SMS plan and end up with unlim SMS, for free.

    Good luck folks!
    ...really, BV? I expected better of you.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by iridescence View Post
    ...really, BV? I expected better of you.
    Thanks ... I think?!

    But better than what?

    I'm merely pointing out to cx how they can 'game' (a pejorative word) the setup ... and even dissuade people from so doing, to boot ... but I'm generally averse to imposing my own morals on how people want to conduct themselves v. Rog (particularly when it comes to cx's resisting Rog's imperious, nasty conduct).

    IOW I can totally understand if someone is comfortable with playing games back at Rog ... but don't recommend it and am obviously not there myself.

    Or to put it another way: Rog, by unsheathing a sword here and trying to bloody a cx by changing contracted fees (and obviously counting on the ability to successfully prey upon the ignorance of most cx's about their rights and remedies available to them) has, knowingly or not, left themselves open to a powerful, defensive counter-attack - a skillful parry and thrust, by a knowledgeable cx, can turn that attack of Rog into one that lands the blade into the midsection of Rog themselves. Oh, the poetic justice!

    And please do differentiate between my counselling or advising people how to do something, with actually counselling or advising them to do something. As well, part of my pointing out this possible strategy was simply to evidence my own deep understanding of this whole issue.

    Information is the original dual-use technology (most memorably, airplanes are another - they peaceably rescue people, transport vacationing people, medical professionals or even organs to save lives ... but can themselves be turned into weapons of horrific destruction in their own right, in ways never intended or seen since WWII and kamikaze pilots).

    I don't recklessly divulge most of the opportunities for abuse upon Rog of which I am aware, but (arguably, only) in this case I have and I leave it to the moral compass of the reader to decide what direction to follow.

    As a final note, had Rog done the ethical thing - impose the fee hike only on new contracts - this 'abuse' or 'game' would not be an issue (i.e. it would have neither opportunity nor justification).

    IMO: If Rog wants to play games with cx's let's have the cx's know what games are open to them, if those cx's want to play that (unethical) game back.

    A chacun son goût.

  9. #9
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    Good post bellvictim. If multiple cx does this,rogers will see the pinch.But im more concerned about people that just accept any change and gladly pay it. Those people are going to get screwed. Espically when receiving sms that cost 20 cents.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BellVictim View Post
    Thanks ... I think?!

    But better than what?
    Generally if someone is not actually recommending a course of action, they don't give explicit instructions for that course of action. :P My point is just that I don't get why you'd even mention it and then try to say that you're not recommending it.

    Also, I am kind of amused that you just compared this whole thing to a sword fight.

  11. #11
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    About the sword - that analogy flows from my love of the expression "swords often have 2 edges", meaning that a tactic wielded by one can often backfire to the wielder and cause them unanticipated harm. And depending on your opinion of the wielder it can actually be quite funny to watch, too.

    I'm colourful, if nothing else : )

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    Colourful is an understatement, my friend

    Thank you for the tips though. I probably won't have time to call after work on second thought but I will definitely do it soon and try reporting back.

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    If my VOICE plan has SMS built-in, ie NOT a Value Pack or Standalone option, what does it fall under? IE: there is no SOC Code on my account for SMS, its part of my Voice Plan...

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    Wirelessly posted (iPhone 4: Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_2_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8C148 Safari/6533.18.5)

    My brain. Explode.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Paolo View Post
    If my VOICE plan has SMS built-in, ie NOT a Value Pack or Standalone option, what does it fall under? IE: there is no SOC Code on my account for SMS, its part of my Voice Plan...
    Type C
    -10 chars min-

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